| Author |
Message |
Peter Hayes
Guest
|
 Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 4:59 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
Bob <spam@uce.gov> wrote:
| Quote: | On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 20:30:24 +0000, not_in_use@btinternet.com (Peter
Hayes) wrote:
HOMELAND SECURITY TOLD SONY TO CEASE AND DESIST!
Cite?
Google-impaired? I found this with a simple search.
+++
© Copyright 1996-2005 The Washington Post Company
DHS Official Weighs In on Sony
By Brian Krebs
A high-ranking Bush administration official weighed in Thursday on
anti-piracy efforts domestically and abroad, indirectly chastising
Sony BMG Music Entertainment for its digital rights management (DRM)
software, which computer security analysis say uses tactics typically
employed by virus writers to hide its components and resist their
removal.
The reference to the scandal over Sony's anti-piracy software came at
a U.S. Chamber of Commerce-sponsored event in downtown Washington on
combating intellectual-property theft. At the event, Stewart Baker,
recently appointed by President Bush as the Department of Homeland
Security's assistant secretary for policy, made a comment that
suggested that some anti-piracy efforts introduced by the industry
could have profound and unexpected effects on the security of the
nation's critical infrastructures.
I wasn't at the conference, but a regular Security Fix reader who also
happens to be a reporter wrote in to say he attended the event and
that I might find it interesting given our coverage of the Sony DRM
fiasco. DHS declined to make Baker available for an interview, but the
Chamber of Commerce was kind enough to provide a Webcast of the event.
Seated on a panel that featured entertainment and technology
executives Mitch Bainwol, chairman and chief executive of the
Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA), as well as Susan
Mann, director of intellectual property policy for Microsoft, Baker
wrapped up his opening comments with the following admonition for the
industry:
"I wanted to raise one point of caution as we go forward, because we
are also responsible for maintaining the security of the information
infrastructure of the United States and making sure peoples' [and]
businesses' computers are secure. ... There's been a lot of publicity
recently about tactics used in pursuing protection for music and DVD
CDs in which questions have been raised about whether the protection
measures install hidden files on peoples' computers that even the
system administrators can't find."
In a remark clearly aimed directly at Sony and other labels, Stewart
continued: "It's very important to remember that it's your
intellectual property -- it's not your computer. And in the pursuit of
protection of intellectual property, it's important not to defeat or
undermine the security measures that people need to adopt in these
days.
"If we have an avian flu outbreak here and it is even half as bad as
the 1918 flu, we will be enormously dependent on being able to get
remote access for a large number of people, and keeping the
infrastructure functioning is going to be a matter of life and death
and we take it very seriously."
+++
|
Thanks for that.
--
Peter |
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Grand Moff Robert Buchana
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 5:32 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 22:25:41 GMT, Aratzio <a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> posted
something accessible as news:mkefn1toc7s6j45im04spebhcv4s0he18l@4ax.com in
alt.usenet.kooks, selections of which I respond to below:
| Quote: | On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 13:03:07 -0700, DevilsPGD <spamsucks@crazyhat.net
got double secret probation because:
In message <48sen110re3eed20jrt09vpd7u0279qjog@4ax.com> Aratzio
a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 03:17:28 -0700, DevilsPGD <spamsucks@crazyhat.net
got double secret probation because:
The CD side has already successfully crippled Sony's consumer audio
devices by preventing hardware-side MP3 support.
QUE?
Sony DVD & CD players play MP3. Whether it is by hardware or software
there is, to the general consumer, no visible difference.
It's not that simple... Sony requires your computer to convert the MP3
file to their own format before a device can handle it.
Umm, why does placing a mp3 disk in a sony DVD player work on my
stereo? Are you confusing "consumer audio devices" with computer
peripherals? Or are you talking about the Ipod type of marketing?
What makes you think that the music side wouldn't be able to get upper
management to shoot the computer accessory department in the foot too?
Most companies outsource the low end consumer products to contract
manufacturers. They do not actually design the hardware or the
firmware. I am sure at additional cost some modification to the
firmware could be added. But the CM would charge, be assured. Not
something you want when margins on low end devices are so slim.
You're thinking backwards --
No, 25 years in the mfg & test business tells me I know exactly how
this works.
Sony wouldn't go looking for a device that
they could add copyright support, they would simply include their
malware into the original design specifications and look for the
cheapest vendor that meets the design specs.
Do you know how the low end works? The CM/OEM (ie LiteOn) is already
building their own product and then sells the product to Sony not the
other way round. The product exists and is not built to spec, simply
externally customized. There is no reason for Sony to expend money
redesigning product that is already built. This is the low end. Design
to specification is a costly process and is not economically viable at
the low end.
|
This is a very enjoyable thread to follow. I'm learning quite a bit, here!
--
Robert Buchanan
Grand Moff of <http://www.robertbuchanan.name/>
Custodian of <http://del.icio.us/rbuchanan>
Master of Mindy (arf)
Quote of the week:
"Why would you think someone who is asexual sees "anything" as a "sex
object"? Your mail order bride wife, for instance, is probably a sexual
being based on the way you act about her. I asked if she liked the pole
and the hole, and yet you bring up "objectification". Talk about
projection..."
-Robert "Chicken Wrist" Wolfe, <11k6f6o45erfpe2@news.supernews.com> |
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Andrew
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 6:19 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
TravelinMan wrote:
| Quote: | In article <opv9n1hln082mrom83caqjfl2ak5rru6mm@4ax.com>,
DevilsPGD <spamsucks@crazyhat.net> wrote:
In message <0m69n1llhrievvce56mj0gpev6l7rcnr08@4ax.com> Alan S
AlanS222@yahoo.com> wrote:
Intentionally or not, the software also
seems to damage a computer's ability to "rip" clean copies of MP3s
from non-copy protected CDs, the security company said.
If it prevents me from manipulating music for which I own the copyright,
that sounds like anti competitive behaviour since it is willfully
interfering with my ability to compete with Sony.
You might want to start out by getting your facts right.
When you buy a CD, you don't own the copyright. You get a license to use
the music, not ownership.
|
You are also wrong. When you buy a CD you get just that - a piece of
plastic in the shape of a circle with some music on it and nothing more
(ok, ok, artwork? and a case too). You can verify my assertion by
breaking any one of your CDs and then returning it to your retailer for
a replacement. Let me know if they honour your license. |
|
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|
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dave hillstrom
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 6:31 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 23:32:33 GMT, in alt.usenet.kooks,
<l2Qdf.13005$cg.2744@news02.roc.ny>, Grand Moff Robert Buchanan
<rbuchanan@neubauten.org> humped my leg thusly:
| Quote: | On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 22:25:41 GMT, Aratzio <a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> posted
something accessible as news:mkefn1toc7s6j45im04spebhcv4s0he18l@4ax.com in
alt.usenet.kooks, selections of which I respond to below:
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 13:03:07 -0700, DevilsPGD <spamsucks@crazyhat.net
got double secret probation because:
In message <48sen110re3eed20jrt09vpd7u0279qjog@4ax.com> Aratzio
a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 03:17:28 -0700, DevilsPGD <spamsucks@crazyhat.net
got double secret probation because:
The CD side has already successfully crippled Sony's consumer audio
devices by preventing hardware-side MP3 support.
QUE?
Sony DVD & CD players play MP3. Whether it is by hardware or software
there is, to the general consumer, no visible difference.
It's not that simple... Sony requires your computer to convert the MP3
file to their own format before a device can handle it.
Umm, why does placing a mp3 disk in a sony DVD player work on my
stereo? Are you confusing "consumer audio devices" with computer
peripherals? Or are you talking about the Ipod type of marketing?
What makes you think that the music side wouldn't be able to get upper
management to shoot the computer accessory department in the foot too?
Most companies outsource the low end consumer products to contract
manufacturers. They do not actually design the hardware or the
firmware. I am sure at additional cost some modification to the
firmware could be added. But the CM would charge, be assured. Not
something you want when margins on low end devices are so slim.
You're thinking backwards --
No, 25 years in the mfg & test business tells me I know exactly how
this works.
Sony wouldn't go looking for a device that
they could add copyright support, they would simply include their
malware into the original design specifications and look for the
cheapest vendor that meets the design specs.
Do you know how the low end works? The CM/OEM (ie LiteOn) is already
building their own product and then sells the product to Sony not the
other way round. The product exists and is not built to spec, simply
externally customized. There is no reason for Sony to expend money
redesigning product that is already built. This is the low end. Design
to specification is a costly process and is not economically viable at
the low end.
This is a very enjoyable thread to follow. I'm learning quite a bit, here!
|
boring! Aratzio is right. DevilsPGD is wrong, and has his head up his ass
for thinking he knows how it works.
--
dave hillstrom
Vote Dave Hillstrom for Whining Whinger in AUK November 2005
the belgians are STILL thieves. Heinous! alWaYs keePinG heR
locKed Up likE a Gor SLAVE GirL!!! NaStY, nAuGhTy BeLgIaNs!!!11! |
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| Back to top |
|
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Bob
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:05 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 22:59:13 +0000, not_in_use@btinternet.com (Peter
Hayes) wrote:
| Quote: | HOMELAND SECURITY TOLD SONY TO CEASE AND DESIST!
Cite?
Google-impaired? I found this with a simple search.
DHS Official Weighs In on Sony
Thanks for that.
|
Did you really doubt me?
I don't make things up.
--
BOYCOTT SONY!
SONY IS TRYING TO TAKE OVER YOUR COMPUTER!
HOMELAND SECURITY TOLD SONY TO CEASE AND DESIST!
YOU DO THE SAME - BOYCOTT SONY! |
|
| Back to top |
|
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Bob
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:11 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 14:25:41 -0800, Aratzio <a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com>
wrote:
| Quote: | 25 years in the mfg & test business tells me I know exactly how
this works.
Design to specification is a costly process and is not economically viable at
the low end.
|
Thanks for those words of wisdom. You have provided yet another datum
point to support our allegation that Sony must be avoided.
We bought a DVD burner from them and all it did was make coasters.
When I asked Sony for support they told me to FOAD. Sony does not
support "OEM" products. Pricks.
Fortunately the vendor took the pos back and traded it for an NEC
3540, which I am happy to report is one of the best, if not the best,
DVD burners on the market.
--
BOYCOTT SONY!
SONY IS TRYING TO TAKE OVER YOUR COMPUTER!
HOMELAND SECURITY TOLD SONY TO CEASE AND DESIST!
YOU DO THE SAME - BOYCOTT SONY! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bob
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:15 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 23:32:33 GMT, Grand Moff Robert Buchanan
<rbuchanan@neubauten.org> wrote:
| Quote: | This is a very enjoyable thread to follow. I'm learning quite a bit, here!
|
This is nothing compared to the threads on CDFreaks.
What blows my mind is that if someone really wants a Lite-On burner
why pay 50% more to get it from Sony, especially when they won't even
support it?
What was that Ol' P.T. Barnum once said about a sucker being born
every minute.
--
BOYCOTT SONY!
SONY IS TRYING TO TAKE OVER YOUR COMPUTER!
HOMELAND SECURITY TOLD SONY TO CEASE AND DESIST!
YOU DO THE SAME - BOYCOTT SONY! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bob
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:20 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 14:35:39 -0800, Aratzio <a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com>
wrote:
| Quote: | That you can just add code willy nilly to a device that you did not design and
do not manufacture?
|
Microsoft has been doing it for years. NT and its derivatives are
based on DEC VAX VMS. Windows is the best PC operating system that DEC
ever invented.
Just as Compaq had to settle with Texas Instruments for using
proprietary designs, so Microsoft had to settle with DEC for the same
reason.
--
BOYCOTT SONY!
SONY IS TRYING TO TAKE OVER YOUR COMPUTER!
HOMELAND SECURITY TOLD SONY TO CEASE AND DESIST!
YOU DO THE SAME - BOYCOTT SONY! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bob
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:21 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 22:48:59 GMT, Grand Moff Robert Buchanan
<rbuchanan@neubauten.org> wrote:
| Quote: | No offense, but what you don't know could fill a warehouse.
FOAD, prick.
You seem to have as much trouble coping with your own ignorance as you
do recieving criticism.
FOAD, prick.
Work that BI, asshole.
|
Another fuckwit troll.
--
BOYCOTT SONY!
SONY IS TRYING TO TAKE OVER YOUR COMPUTER!
HOMELAND SECURITY TOLD SONY TO CEASE AND DESIST!
YOU DO THE SAME - BOYCOTT SONY! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
relic
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:23 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
Bob wrote:
| Quote: | On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 23:32:33 GMT, Grand Moff Robert Buchanan
rbuchanan@neubauten.org> wrote:
This is a very enjoyable thread to follow. I'm learning quite a
bit, here!
This is nothing compared to the threads on CDFreaks.
What blows my mind is that if someone really wants a Lite-On burner
why pay 50% more to get it from Sony, especially when they won't even
support it?
What was that Ol' P.T. Barnum once said about a sucker being born
every minute.
|
David Hannum.
http://www.historybuff.com/library/refbarnum.html
--
They call it PMS because Mad Cow Disease was already taken. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sean Monaghan
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:25 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
Grand Moff Robert Buchanan wrote:
| Quote: | On Mon, 14 Nov 2005 03:00:53 GMT, DevilsPGD <spamsucks@crazyhat.net
posted something accessible as
news:52ufn1hr96u8l0vb0e60kgalfaajf04lia@4ax.com in alt.usenet.kooks,
selections of which I respond to below:
In message <mkefn1toc7s6j45im04spebhcv4s0he18l@4ax.com> Aratzio
a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 13:03:07 -0700, DevilsPGD
spamsucks@crazyhat.net> got double secret probation because:
In message <48sen110re3eed20jrt09vpd7u0279qjog@4ax.com> Aratzio
a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 03:17:28 -0700, DevilsPGD
spamsucks@crazyhat.net> got double secret probation because:
The CD side has already successfully crippled Sony's
consumer audio devices by preventing hardware-side MP3
support.
QUE?
Sony DVD & CD players play MP3. Whether it is by hardware or
software there is, to the general consumer, no visible
difference.
It's not that simple... Sony requires your computer to convert
the MP3 file to their own format before a device can handle it.
Umm, why does placing a mp3 disk in a sony DVD player work on my
stereo? Are you confusing "consumer audio devices" with computer
peripherals? Or are you talking about the Ipod type of marketing?
Sorry I was specifically referring to their flash-based players.
Whether they've gotten with the times or not now, I don't know, but
they certainly did not simply purchase a random generic product and
stamp the Sony name on it.
Let me get this straight: you have to convert your audio files to a
proprietary format of Sony's before you can play them on one of their
players?! Insanity.
|
Greedy, too - typical Sony. Don't forget that the majority of Sony
digital cameras will only accept a proprietary, higher-priced "Memory
Stick", as opposed to most other manufacturers using standard CF or SD
memory cards.
--
Sean Monaghan
Samaritan Awards: http://www.hydroclick.com/samaritan |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Grand Moff Robert Buchana
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:25 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On Mon, 14 Nov 2005 03:00:53 GMT, DevilsPGD <spamsucks@crazyhat.net> posted
something accessible as news:52ufn1hr96u8l0vb0e60kgalfaajf04lia@4ax.com in
alt.usenet.kooks, selections of which I respond to below:
| Quote: | In message <mkefn1toc7s6j45im04spebhcv4s0he18l@4ax.com> Aratzio
a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 13:03:07 -0700, DevilsPGD <spamsucks@crazyhat.net
got double secret probation because:
In message <48sen110re3eed20jrt09vpd7u0279qjog@4ax.com> Aratzio
a6ahlyv02@sneakemail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 03:17:28 -0700, DevilsPGD <spamsucks@crazyhat.net
got double secret probation because:
The CD side has already successfully crippled Sony's consumer audio
devices by preventing hardware-side MP3 support.
QUE?
Sony DVD & CD players play MP3. Whether it is by hardware or software
there is, to the general consumer, no visible difference.
It's not that simple... Sony requires your computer to convert the MP3
file to their own format before a device can handle it.
Umm, why does placing a mp3 disk in a sony DVD player work on my
stereo? Are you confusing "consumer audio devices" with computer
peripherals? Or are you talking about the Ipod type of marketing?
Sorry I was specifically referring to their flash-based players.
Whether they've gotten with the times or not now, I don't know, but they
certainly did not simply purchase a random generic product and stamp the
Sony name on it.
|
Let me get this straight: you have to convert your audio files to a
proprietary format of Sony's before you can play them on one of their
players?! Insanity.
--
Robert Buchanan
Grand Moff of <http://www.robertbuchanan.name/>
Custodian of <http://del.icio.us/rbuchanan>
Master of Mindy (arf)
Quote of the week:
"Why would you think someone who is asexual sees "anything" as a "sex
object"? Your mail order bride wife, for instance, is probably a sexual
being based on the way you act about her. I asked if she liked the pole
and the hole, and yet you bring up "objectification". Talk about
projection..."
-Robert "Chicken Wrist" Wolfe, <11k6f6o45erfpe2@news.supernews.com> |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Grand Moff Robert Buchana
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:25 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On Mon, 14 Nov 2005 02:15:01 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) posted something
accessible as news:4377f248.35095078@news-server.houston.rr.com in
alt.usenet.kooks, selections of which I respond to below:
| Quote: | On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 23:32:33 GMT, Grand Moff Robert Buchanan
rbuchanan@neubauten.org> wrote:
This is a very enjoyable thread to follow. I'm learning quite a bit,
here!
This is nothing compared to the threads on CDFreaks.
What blows my mind is that if someone really wants a Lite-On burner
why pay 50% more to get it from Sony, especially when they won't even
support it?
What was that Ol' P.T. Barnum once said about a sucker being born
every minute.
|
Tell me about it. It's absurd how much weight a name can carry in the
minds of a consumer. Sony is a very naked emperor.
--
Robert Buchanan
Grand Moff of <http://www.robertbuchanan.name/>
Custodian of <http://del.icio.us/rbuchanan>
Master of Mindy (arf)
Quote of the week:
"Why would you think someone who is asexual sees "anything" as a "sex
object"? Your mail order bride wife, for instance, is probably a sexual
being based on the way you act about her. I asked if she liked the pole
and the hole, and yet you bring up "objectification". Talk about
projection..."
-Robert "Chicken Wrist" Wolfe, <11k6f6o45erfpe2@news.supernews.com> |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Grand Moff Robert Buchana
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:25 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On Mon, 14 Nov 2005 02:21:27 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) posted something
accessible as news:4377f489.35672515@news-server.houston.rr.com in
alt.usenet.kooks, selections of which I respond to below:
| Quote: | On Sun, 13 Nov 2005 22:48:59 GMT, Grand Moff Robert Buchanan
rbuchanan@neubauten.org> wrote:
No offense, but what you don't know could fill a warehouse.
FOAD, prick.
You seem to have as much trouble coping with your own ignorance as you
do recieving criticism.
FOAD, prick.
Work that BI, asshole.
Another fuckwit troll.
|
What are you going to do about me?
--
Robert Buchanan
Grand Moff of <http://www.robertbuchanan.name/>
Custodian of <http://del.icio.us/rbuchanan>
Master of Mindy (arf)
Quote of the week:
"Why would you think someone who is asexual sees "anything" as a "sex
object"? Your mail order bride wife, for instance, is probably a sexual
being based on the way you act about her. I asked if she liked the pole
and the hole, and yet you bring up "objectification". Talk about
projection..."
-Robert "Chicken Wrist" Wolfe, <11k6f6o45erfpe2@news.supernews.com> |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bob
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:25 am Post subject:
Re: Please don't hate SONY for their one mistake with DRM pr |
|
|
On 13 Nov 2005 16:19:50 -0800, "Andrew" <internet@eretronet.com>
wrote:
| Quote: | When you buy a CD you get just that - a piece of
plastic in the shape of a circle with some music on it and nothing more
(ok, ok, artwork? and a case too). You can verify my assertion by
breaking any one of your CDs and then returning it to your retailer for
a replacement. Let me know if they honour your license.
|
I wonder if I can copyright my offspring. After all they are the
result of my creativity. Does that then mean that anyone who enjoys
them has to pay me a royalty?
How about teachers copyrighting their students. The possibilities are
endless.
--
BOYCOTT SONY!
SONY IS TRYING TO TAKE OVER YOUR COMPUTER!
HOMELAND SECURITY TOLD SONY TO CEASE AND DESIST!
YOU DO THE SAME - BOYCOTT SONY! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
|
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