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Message |
a l l y
Guest
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 Posted:
Mon Oct 17, 2005 4:19 pm Post subject:
Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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Hi
Most printers these days seem to be targetted at photographers, and although
I do use a digital camera, most of my photos stay on the computer or on the
net, rather than getting printed out. I am an artist, and I want to make
prints of the artwork I produce on the computer. I want to use good quality,
acid-free, heavyweight, artists' quality paper with non-fading inks. Is this
a pipe-dream? I also need to do bog-standard, day-to-day printing as well,
of course, and I also print little books on craftwork so I need something
with fairly large ink tanks, as I hate having to change them in the middle
of a print run.
Any ideas, suggestions or comments will be carefully considered. Thank you.
ally |
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zakezuke
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Oct 17, 2005 4:58 pm Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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| Quote: | I am an artist, and I want to make prints of the
artwork I produce on the computer.
I want to use good quality, acid-free, heavyweight,
artists' quality paper with non-fading inks. Is this
a pipe-dream? I also need to do bog-standard,
day-to-day printing as well, of course, and I also
print little books on craftwork so I need something
with fairly large ink tanks, as I hate having to
change them in the middle of a print run.
|
Canon is pretty much out. The new chromalife100 inks are I believe
rated for under 30 years under glass on their offical papers. I don't
have experence with the current generation inks but the older
generation stuff faided fast on my window sill.
That leaves Epson, HP, and perhaps Brother.
Epson has pigments or dyes depend on the model you choose, and HP has
vivera ink, dye that is reported as being very fade resistant.
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/hp/8450.html
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/epson/WIR_EpR320_2005_06_18.pdf
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/epson/WIR_Ep_R800_2004_12_03.pdf
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/news/B1028733427/C1779792688/E20050711093817/
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/epson/R2400.html |
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Jon O'Brien
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Oct 17, 2005 6:42 pm Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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In article <1129550321.128520.225090@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
zakezuke_us@yahoo.com (zakezuke) wrote:
| Quote: | http://www.wilhelm-research.com/...
|
I wouldn't trust Wilhelm's figures unless your prints are only to be
displayed under fluorescent light.
Check out the more realistic daylight ratings on Stephen Livick's
site at: http://tinyurl.com/9ql1 http://tinyurl.com/97utj and
http://tinyurl.com/dlr9o.
You should also read http://tinyurl.com/9yz8q and http://tinyurl.com/alegy
and many other pages on Livick's site.
I see that, in a later post, you mention using a fixative spray. That's
something else you should check out on Stephen Livick's site. Many of the
coatings crack or yellow badly. Clear Shield seems to be the best but you
need to roll or brush it on.
Jon. |
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Arthur Entlich
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:10 pm Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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You did not state how large the output needs to be nor your budget.
Also, is there some general "type" of image you produce (something that
mimics more traditional artform, like pen and ink prints, watercolor,
oil?) some printer will better represent certain media better than others.
a l l y wrote:
| Quote: | Hi
Most printers these days seem to be targetted at photographers, and although
I do use a digital camera, most of my photos stay on the computer or on the
net, rather than getting printed out. I am an artist, and I want to make
prints of the artwork I produce on the computer. I want to use good quality,
acid-free, heavyweight, artists' quality paper with non-fading inks. Is this
a pipe-dream? I also need to do bog-standard, day-to-day printing as well,
of course, and I also print little books on craftwork so I need something
with fairly large ink tanks, as I hate having to change them in the middle
of a print run.
Any ideas, suggestions or comments will be carefully considered. Thank you.
ally
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Arthur Entlich
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:12 pm Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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I believe Vivera inks only maintain their fade resistance when used with
HP's swellable polymer papers, which probably makes them water soluble,
and of limited paper surfaces and stocks.
Art
zakezuke wrote:
| Quote: | I am an artist, and I want to make prints of the
artwork I produce on the computer.
I want to use good quality, acid-free, heavyweight,
artists' quality paper with non-fading inks. Is this
a pipe-dream? I also need to do bog-standard,
day-to-day printing as well, of course, and I also
print little books on craftwork so I need something
with fairly large ink tanks, as I hate having to
change them in the middle of a print run.
Canon is pretty much out. The new chromalife100 inks are I believe
rated for under 30 years under glass on their offical papers. I don't
have experence with the current generation inks but the older
generation stuff faided fast on my window sill.
That leaves Epson, HP, and perhaps Brother.
Epson has pigments or dyes depend on the model you choose, and HP has
vivera ink, dye that is reported as being very fade resistant.
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/hp/8450.html
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/epson/WIR_EpR320_2005_06_18.pdf
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/epson/WIR_Ep_R800_2004_12_03.pdf
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/news/B1028733427/C1779792688/E20050711093817/
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/epson/R2400.html
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a l l y
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Oct 17, 2005 9:06 pm Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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"Arthur Entlich" <e-printerhelp@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:MhO4f.225988$tl2.30023@pd7tw3no...
| Quote: | You did not state how large the output needs to be nor your budget. Also,
is there some general "type" of image you produce (something that mimics
more traditional artform, like pen and ink prints, watercolor, oil?) some
printer will better represent certain media better than others.
Well, Ideally I'd love to be able to print bigger than A4, but my budget is |
limited. I'm prepared to pay a bit more than the cost of a bog standard
printer, but unfortunately I can't afford a top quality professional machine
so it'll have to be a compromise I guess. Are there any printers that would
allow me to use paper that's longer than A4 - banner-type printing, I
suppose you'd call it?
As for the "type" of image - good question - I guess I'd like it to look
like a screen print more than anything. At the moment I'm printing on heavy
card-type paper - the sort of thing that's embossed with a pattern like
canvas or like watercolour paper - and it looks great, though I don't expect
it to last very well. I've been advised that spraying it with fixative and
putting it behind glass will help, and making sure I use acid-free paper. I
suppose I could cut ordinary watercolour paper into sheets of the right size
if it would take the ink properly.
ally |
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me@privacy.net
Guest
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| Posted:
Mon Oct 17, 2005 9:49 pm Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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In message <3ri0g5Fj3fiuU1@individual.net>, a l l y
<ally@situponDOGGIEseats.co.uk> writes
| Quote: | Well, Ideally I'd love to be able to print bigger than A4, but my budget is
limited. I'm prepared to pay a bit more than the cost of a bog standard
printer, but unfortunately I can't afford a top quality professional machine
so it'll have to be a compromise I guess. Are there any printers that would
allow me to use paper that's longer than A4 - banner-type printing, I
suppose you'd call it?
As for the "type" of image - good question - I guess I'd like it to look
like a screen print more than anything. At the moment I'm printing on heavy
card-type paper - the sort of thing that's embossed with a pattern like
canvas or like watercolour paper - and it looks great, though I don't expect
it to last very well. I've been advised that spraying it with fixative and
putting it behind glass will help, and making sure I use acid-free paper. I
suppose I could cut ordinary watercolour paper into sheets of the right size
if it would take the ink properly.
You could possibly look at OKI's colour lasers (LED), at least get a |
sample print from them, see if it might be what you want. Most (all?)
of their A4 colour lasers will print banners up to about 4 feet IIRC.
--
Timothy |
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Davy
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:39 am Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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One site you may have a look on is-:
http://www.wetcanvas.com/ they specialise in that sort of work, well
worth a look in, their forum well worth a visit.
Davy |
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Yianni
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Oct 18, 2005 2:33 am Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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As Arthur stated, the paper size is the most significant thing. For A4 (8-9
inches wide) I suggest the epson C86, C88, D88, C66, etc ($100). But I think
A4 is small enough. It's better to move to a A3 printer (11 inches wide) I
suggest the epson R2400 ($500?).
Increasing the printed size the price increases much more. Both above
printers use pigment inks (archival). In all inkjet printers you can print
banners, the limit is the width of the paper. For A2 size (16 inches) the
price is about $1500, and so on.
--
--
Yianni
in@mailbox9.gr (remove number nine to reply)
--
"a l l y" <ally@situponDOGGIEseats.co.uk> wrote in message
news:3ri0g5Fj3fiuU1@individual.net...
| Quote: |
"Arthur Entlich" <e-printerhelp@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:MhO4f.225988$tl2.30023@pd7tw3no...
You did not state how large the output needs to be nor your budget.
Also,
is there some general "type" of image you produce (something that mimics
more traditional artform, like pen and ink prints, watercolor, oil?)
some
printer will better represent certain media better than others.
Well, Ideally I'd love to be able to print bigger than A4, but my budget
is
limited. I'm prepared to pay a bit more than the cost of a bog standard
printer, but unfortunately I can't afford a top quality professional
machine
so it'll have to be a compromise I guess. Are there any printers that
would
allow me to use paper that's longer than A4 - banner-type printing, I
suppose you'd call it?
As for the "type" of image - good question - I guess I'd like it to look
like a screen print more than anything. At the moment I'm printing on
heavy
card-type paper - the sort of thing that's embossed with a pattern like
canvas or like watercolour paper - and it looks great, though I don't
expect
it to last very well. I've been advised that spraying it with fixative and
putting it behind glass will help, and making sure I use acid-free paper.
I
suppose I could cut ordinary watercolour paper into sheets of the right
size
if it would take the ink properly.
ally
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Bob Headrick
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:20 am Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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"Jon O'Brien" <Jon@NOonlySPAMbrowsingTHANX.com> wrote in message
news:memo.20051017194215.392C@blue.compulink.co.uk...
I would not say Livick's site is more realistic - for example, the HP printer
used is a three year old model that does not use the new inks, and they provide
test results for two dozen paper combinations including Epson and Canon
aper - but no HP paper, which the HP is designed to work with. I would use
http://www.wilhelm-research.com/ for comparisons on recent stuff with a bit
less bias.
- Bob Headrick, MS MVP Printing/Imaging |
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zakezuke
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:39 am Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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| Quote: | Are there any printers that would
allow me to use paper that's longer than A4 - banner-type printing, I
suppose you'd call it?
|
You'll find that 24 inchs is a typical limit on your average a4
printer.
Double checking the canons I own, they are locked to print on a max
height of 59.4cm. / 23.9 in, where my epson r200 was 44 in according to
the specs. |
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Viktor Darnedde
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:12 pm Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 17:06:28 +0100 a l l y wrote:
| Quote: | "Arthur Entlich" <e-printerhelp@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:MhO4f.225988$tl2.30023@pd7tw3no...
You did not state how large the output needs to be nor your budget. Also,
is there some general "type" of image you produce (something that mimics
more traditional artform, like pen and ink prints, watercolor, oil?) some
printer will better represent certain media better than others.
Well, Ideally I'd love to be able to print bigger than A4, but my budget is
limited. I'm prepared to pay a bit more than the cost of a bog standard
printer, but unfortunately I can't afford a top quality professional machine
so it'll have to be a compromise I guess. Are there any printers that would
allow me to use paper that's longer than A4 - banner-type printing, I
suppose you'd call it?
|
Well, this sounds like you are going to print on matte or watercolor paper.
Ask yourself what your print volume is going to be!
I am very happy with my Epson Stylus Photo 2100, an A3+ pigmented ink
printer. I print my digital photos with this printer. My print volume isn't
that high but I refill my OEM cartridges with Epson Ultrachrome ink which I
take from the bigger cartridges of the Epson Pro printers. If you know how
to do it, it's pretty easy. This cuts down ink cost considerably.
If you want to make a living out of your art work and prints consider an
Epson Stylus Pro 4000. It takes reasonably prized single ink cartridges
with 110ml or 220ml, prints very well on heavy matte papers up to A2. The
initial costs might be high but aren't in the long run.
\relax\bye % Viktor 8-) |
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Arthur Entlich
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:54 pm Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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If you wish to print on a heavyweighted paper or canvas and you are
looking for permanence, and you are not concerned about very subtle
gradients like those found in say, a sky in a photograph, you can
probably use something like a C66 or C86 Epson.
I suggest these for a few reasons:
1) They use Durabrite inks, which are pigment colorant based and these
inks will last nearly 100 years under glass or a good 50+ under normal
lighting conditions.
2) These printers use only 4 colors CMYK, which will provide you with a
less costly ink situation, while still providing something approaching a
"screened image"
3) There are heavy card, paper and canvas stocks made for these
printers, and they will do a fairly good job on uncoated non-specialty
stock. The results will not be a crisp and contrasty, but if the inks
stock properly to the surface, they should still maintain relatively
good permanence.
Negatives: Durabrite inks are more likely to clog than others if the
printer is used seldomly or in a dusty or very dry conditions.
Non-Durabrite substitute inks may not have the same characteristics.
Some may even be dye colorant based.
Limited to a bit over 8" wide by 44" long. All Epson letter printers
will print up to 44" using Epson's own software.
The C66 is not as fast or robust as the C86.
Other options, although more costly to buy and feeds are the R800
(letter size) and it's wider brother the R1800, and the 2400, both
offering up to 13" wide, Ultrachrome pigment inks, and multiple ink colors..
Art
Art
a l l y wrote:
| Quote: | "Arthur Entlich" <e-printerhelp@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:MhO4f.225988$tl2.30023@pd7tw3no...
You did not state how large the output needs to be nor your budget. Also,
is there some general "type" of image you produce (something that mimics
more traditional artform, like pen and ink prints, watercolor, oil?) some
printer will better represent certain media better than others.
Well, Ideally I'd love to be able to print bigger than A4, but my budget is
limited. I'm prepared to pay a bit more than the cost of a bog standard
printer, but unfortunately I can't afford a top quality professional machine
so it'll have to be a compromise I guess. Are there any printers that would
allow me to use paper that's longer than A4 - banner-type printing, I
suppose you'd call it?
As for the "type" of image - good question - I guess I'd like it to look
like a screen print more than anything. At the moment I'm printing on heavy
card-type paper - the sort of thing that's embossed with a pattern like
canvas or like watercolour paper - and it looks great, though I don't expect
it to last very well. I've been advised that spraying it with fixative and
putting it behind glass will help, and making sure I use acid-free paper. I
suppose I could cut ordinary watercolour paper into sheets of the right size
if it would take the ink properly.
ally
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Arthur Entlich
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Oct 18, 2005 2:12 pm Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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I know of no consumer color laser printers which can print banner size,
other than by breaking the image up into sections legal size or smaller
and then adhering them together. I also know of none that will print on
heavyweighted stock or canvas other than via a transfer process
involving laminates, adhesives and a heated press.
Most laser printers produce contrasty images still, relative to inkjets.
Art
me@privacy.net wrote:
| Quote: | In message <3ri0g5Fj3fiuU1@individual.net>, a l l y
ally@situponDOGGIEseats.co.uk> writes
Well, Ideally I'd love to be able to print bigger than A4, but my
budget is
limited. I'm prepared to pay a bit more than the cost of a bog standard
printer, but unfortunately I can't afford a top quality professional
machine
so it'll have to be a compromise I guess. Are there any printers that
would
allow me to use paper that's longer than A4 - banner-type printing, I
suppose you'd call it?
As for the "type" of image - good question - I guess I'd like it to look
like a screen print more than anything. At the moment I'm printing on
heavy
card-type paper - the sort of thing that's embossed with a pattern like
canvas or like watercolour paper - and it looks great, though I don't
expect
it to last very well. I've been advised that spraying it with fixative
and
putting it behind glass will help, and making sure I use acid-free
paper. I
suppose I could cut ordinary watercolour paper into sheets of the
right size
if it would take the ink properly.
You could possibly look at OKI's colour lasers (LED), at least get a
sample print from them, see if it might be what you want. Most (all?)
of their A4 colour lasers will print banners up to about 4 feet IIRC.
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a l l y
Guest
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| Posted:
Tue Oct 18, 2005 2:25 pm Post subject:
Re: Printers for artists - any suggestions? |
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Both these sites make fascinating reading - thanks guys. Looks like I'll not
get any work done today...
ally |
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