adaptec SCSI cards 'generally' and 'fallback negotiaons' to
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adaptec SCSI cards 'generally' and 'fallback negotiaons' to

 
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dave
Guest
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 5:07 am    Post subject: adaptec SCSI cards 'generally' and 'fallback negotiaons' to Reply with quote
LONG ago, I owned a scsi mac, but that was then. now I'm on an XP box,
been about 4 yrs now, and I need to buy a USED SCSI card (unclear what
model just yet - ebay will be involved, it'll be adaptec 29** something...)

in any event, my present need is for runing an old Nikon LS-1000 film
scanner (which I'm guessing is oldie-goldie SCSI 1 thing, seeing as its
instructions mainly mention win95and NT). *but*, I'd also like to have
some "going-forward compatibility" (as stock analysts say), for like
using it with scsi2 devices, and maybe scsi3 devices, if it's doable
without too much 'fiscal depletion of the walletary gland'. not looking
or hoping for any 'ultra160' or any 'super modern' SCSI's useabilities,
like fast wides.

here's todays main question:

are "MOST, if not ALL" windows/adaptec SCSI cards "generally speaking"
capable of fall-back negotiations to a slower, older form of SCSI
(transfer speed) in order to (in effect) match their transfer speed to
the speed of the device that's actually hooked *TO* the card thru the cable?

here's a "for example": adaptec's site describes the AHA-2930CU card as
"scsi 2" while making no mention of that particualar card having any
scsiONE speed/capabilities....so, could I use it with an old scsi ONE
device (at scsi ONE device transfer speeds, of course). or would it be
'totally non-functional/dead-brick-like' if attempted?

top of adaptec's card descriptions:
http://adaptec.com/worldwide/support/suppbyproduct.jsp?sess=no&language=English+US&cat=%2FTechnology%2FSCSI+Host+Adapters&fromPage=supportindex


let me ask another way: (assuming number or wires in the connector and
connectors compatability) *are* there some adaptec SCSI cards that can
NOT "fall back negotiate" for using then with older slower devices from
'the next rung down the transfer-speed ladder'?

thanks for educating,

toolie
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Guest
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 6:57 am    Post subject: Re: adaptec SCSI cards 'generally' and 'fallback negotiaons' Reply with quote
dave wrote:

Quote:
here's todays main question:


here's a "for example": adaptec's site describes the AHA-2930CU card as
"scsi 2" while making no mention of that particualar card having any
scsiONE speed/capabilities....so, could I use it with an old scsi ONE
device (at scsi ONE device transfer speeds, of course). or would it be
'totally non-functional/dead-brick-like' if attempted?


Not sure about the 2930cu, but various 2940's and 3940's can be set
to lower than max.

I could be wrong, but I think that if you set any device to "async"
(2.5mb/sec) then it might be that all devices on the bus are forced
to fall back to that speed.
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Triffid
Guest
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 7:27 am    Post subject: Re: adaptec SCSI cards 'generally' and 'fallback negotiaons' Reply with quote
dave wrote:

Quote:
LONG ago, I owned a scsi mac, but that was then. now I'm on an XP box,
been about 4 yrs now, and I need to buy a USED SCSI card (unclear what
model just yet - ebay will be involved, it'll be adaptec 29** something...)

in any event, my present need is for runing an old Nikon LS-1000 film
scanner (which I'm guessing is oldie-goldie SCSI 1 thing, seeing as its
instructions mainly mention win95and NT). *but*, I'd also like to have
some "going-forward compatibility" (as stock analysts say), for like
using it with scsi2 devices, and maybe scsi3 devices, if it's doable
without too much 'fiscal depletion of the walletary gland'. not looking
or hoping for any 'ultra160' or any 'super modern' SCSI's useabilities,
like fast wides.

here's todays main question:

are "MOST, if not ALL" windows/adaptec SCSI cards "generally speaking"
capable of fall-back negotiations to a slower, older form of SCSI
(transfer speed) in order to (in effect) match their transfer speed to
the speed of the device that's actually hooked *TO* the card thru the
cable?

here's a "for example": adaptec's site describes the AHA-2930CU card as
"scsi 2" while making no mention of that particualar card having any
scsiONE speed/capabilities....so, could I use it with an old scsi ONE
device (at scsi ONE device transfer speeds, of course). or would it be
'totally non-functional/dead-brick-like' if attempted?

top of adaptec's card descriptions:
http://adaptec.com/worldwide/support/suppbyproduct.jsp?sess=no&language=English+US&cat=%2FTechnology%2FSCSI+Host+Adapters&fromPage=supportindex



let me ask another way: (assuming number or wires in the connector and
connectors compatability) *are* there some adaptec SCSI cards that can
NOT "fall back negotiate" for using then with older slower devices from
'the next rung down the transfer-speed ladder'?

thanks for educating,

toolie

SCSI is backwards compatible, no ifs, ands, or buts.

(there is an except - HVD - run away if you encounter it)

Triffid
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Ron Reaugh
Guest
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 7:27 am    Post subject: Re: adaptec SCSI cards 'generally' and 'fallback negotiaons' Reply with quote
<localuser@localhost.localdomain> wrote in message
news:42B773F5.6883@localhost.localdomain...
Quote:
dave wrote:

here's todays main question:


here's a "for example": adaptec's site describes the AHA-2930CU card as
"scsi 2" while making no mention of that particualar card having any
scsiONE speed/capabilities....so, could I use it with an old scsi ONE
device (at scsi ONE device transfer speeds, of course). or would it be
'totally non-functional/dead-brick-like' if attempted?


Not sure about the 2930cu, but various 2940's and 3940's can be set
to lower than max.


On all those cards each device will negotiate its own speed. SCSI is
backwards compatible. Get a 29160 but a 2930cu would work but won't support
an LVD HD well.
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Folkert Rienstra
Guest
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 8:04 pm    Post subject: Re: adaptec SCSI cards 'generally' and 'fallback negotiaons' Reply with quote
"Ron Reaugh" <ron-reaugh@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message news:NrNte.342959$cg1.112151@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net
Quote:
localuser@localhost.localdomain> wrote in message news:42B773F5.6883@localhost.localdomain...
dave wrote:

here's todays main question:


here's a "for example": adaptec's site describes the AHA-2930CU card as
"scsi 2" while making no mention of that particular card having any
scsiONE speed/capabilities....so, could I use it with an old scsi ONE
device (at scsi ONE device transfer speeds, of course). or would it be
'totally non-functional/dead-brick-like' if attempted?


Not sure about the 2930cu, but various 2940's and 3940's can be set
to lower than max.


On all those cards each device

will negotiate

will be negotiated to

Quote:
its own speed.

SCSI is backwards compatible.
Get a 29160 but a 2930cu would work but won't support an LVD HD well.
Back to top
Guest
Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 10:25 pm    Post subject: Re: adaptec SCSI cards 'generally' and 'fallback negotiaons' Reply with quote
Ron Reaugh wrote:
Quote:

localuser@localhost.localdomain> wrote in message
news:42B773F5.6883@localhost.localdomain...
dave wrote:

here's todays main question:


here's a "for example": adaptec's site describes the AHA-2930CU card as
"scsi 2" while making no mention of that particualar card having any
scsiONE speed/capabilities....so, could I use it with an old scsi ONE
device (at scsi ONE device transfer speeds, of course). or would it be
'totally non-functional/dead-brick-like' if attempted?


Not sure about the 2930cu, but various 2940's and 3940's can be set
to lower than max.

On all those cards each device will negotiate its own speed. SCSI is
backwards compatible. Get a 29160 but a 2930cu would work but won't support
an LVD HD well.

I've seen it happen sometimes that setting an attempted negotiation
speed
too high can make some really old periphs turn into temporary bricks.
Though
it might have just been the included ancient cabling.
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Arie Bant
Guest
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 7:27 am    Post subject: Re: adaptec SCSI cards 'generally' and 'fallback negotiaons' Reply with quote
On 21/06/05 03:58, Triffid wrote:
Quote:


dave wrote:

LONG ago, I owned a scsi mac, but that was then. now I'm on an XP box,
been about 4 yrs now, and I need to buy a USED SCSI card (unclear what
model just yet - ebay will be involved, it'll be adaptec 29**
something...)

in any event, my present need is for runing an old Nikon LS-1000 film
scanner (which I'm guessing is oldie-goldie SCSI 1 thing, seeing as
its instructions mainly mention win95and NT). *but*, I'd also like to
have some "going-forward compatibility" (as stock analysts say), for
like using it with scsi2 devices, and maybe scsi3 devices, if it's
doable without too much 'fiscal depletion of the walletary gland'. not
looking or hoping for any 'ultra160' or any 'super modern' SCSI's
useabilities, like fast wides.

here's todays main question:

are "MOST, if not ALL" windows/adaptec SCSI cards "generally speaking"
capable of fall-back negotiations to a slower, older form of SCSI
(transfer speed) in order to (in effect) match their transfer speed to
the speed of the device that's actually hooked *TO* the card thru the
cable?

here's a "for example": adaptec's site describes the AHA-2930CU card
as "scsi 2" while making no mention of that particualar card having
any scsiONE speed/capabilities....so, could I use it with an old scsi
ONE device (at scsi ONE device transfer speeds, of course). or would
it be 'totally non-functional/dead-brick-like' if attempted?

top of adaptec's card descriptions:
http://adaptec.com/worldwide/support/suppbyproduct.jsp?sess=no&language=English+US&cat=%2FTechnology%2FSCSI+Host+Adapters&fromPage=supportindex



let me ask another way: (assuming number or wires in the connector and
connectors compatability) *are* there some adaptec SCSI cards that can
NOT "fall back negotiate" for using then with older slower devices
from 'the next rung down the transfer-speed ladder'?

thanks for educating,

toolie


SCSI is backwards compatible, no ifs, ands, or buts.

(there is an except - HVD - run away if you encounter it)

Triffid

There is a "but". Connect a single ended drive to an LVD enabled bus
and the whole bus will work in single ended mode. But it will work,
just not optimally.
I would suggest that for narrow SCSI devices you get something like a
SYMBIOS 53C810 based card. Made by many PC Card makers, cheap and
reliable. Also compatible with the Intel PCI BIOS extension, which
contains a SCSI BIOS and forms part of many (clone) BIOS's.

Make sure that the Nikon scanner does not have a differential SCSI
interface. If that happens to be the case you need a differential SCSI
Host Adapter. Nowadays "differential SCSI" is often called "High
Voltage Differential" (=HVD) to distinguish it from the more modern
"LVD" (=Low Voltage Differential).
HVD is not compatible with Single Ended or LVD. Mixing HVD and non-HVD
can cause damage to the interface circuits and make the devices useless.
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